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in new york. our road to the white house coverage of the presidential candidates continues live from the iowa state fair on c-span, c-span radio, and c-span.org. as the candidates walk the fairgrounds and speak at "the des moines register's" candidate soap box. this morning at 11:00 a.m. eastern, it's senator ted cruz. on saturday, republican governors chris christie at noon and bobby jindal at 1:00. join the twitter conversation at #dmrsoapbox.can al c-span's campaign 2016, taking you on the road to the white house. are we living in a society of entitlement today where everybody gets a trophy, or is there value in encouraging participation? and that's ourit discussion ite this first segment of "the washington journal."

this week, james harrison of the pittsburgh steelers posted on instagram this message.ing. i came home to find out that my boys received two trophies for y nothing. participationer trophies. while i am very proud of my boyi for everything they do and will encourage them until the day i die, these trophies will be given back until they earn a real trophy. i'm sorry i'm not sorry for believing that everything in life should be earned. i'm not about to raise two boys to be men by making them believm that they are entitled to something just because they tried their best.ing in are we living in a world of everybody gets a trophy?ether we want to get your opinion on whether or not you think riate participation trophies and passing out of awards is an appropriate reward for participating. 202 is the area code. 748-8000 if you agree everybodye trophy.et a

202-748-8001 if you disagree. now, this issue raised by mr. harrison of the pittsburgh ace f steelers has become an issue in the national media. kelly wallace of cnn has posted this article. does sports participation with deserve a trophy? let the parental debate begin. whoa, who knew the debate over participation trophies, those awards children get just for showing up and playing sports, would strike such a cord.he wou after nfl linebacker james harrison took to instagram this weekendan announcing he would b sending back the trophies his sons, 6 and 8 years old, received until they earn a real trophy, parents on social mediai responded in droves with majority applauding harrison, who plays for the pittsburgh steelers. super bowl champ kurt warner on twitter stood fully with harrison.howing quote, they don't let kids pass classes for just showing up,

warner wrote. on the other side, are parents r such as whit honia, a father of twond sons who participant in sport, and he's the author of the parent phrase book. while honia, who's also coachedr sports, doesn't believe trophies are necessary, he does believe they reward effort, not the final outcome.veryon quote, the idea of a participation trophy is not to make everyone a winner but to ot acknowledge that the child put time and effort forward and to provide a memento of the ue. experience. so that's part of the argument. we want to the get your opinion on this issue.02) 748- 202 is the area code. 748-8000 if you agree. 202-748-8001 if you disagree. if you can't get through on the phone lines, you can also

contact us via social media. @cspanwj is our twitter handle. you can make a comment on our o facebook page at facebook.com/cspan. first call up is john in new york city. john, what do you think about n everybodyyo gets a trophy and ti potential for living in a society of entitlement? >> caller: yes, i disagree thath everyone should get a trophy because it sets kids up for failure and for a sad look on the world because, i mean, you don't always get a trophy for participating in life. on the other hand, i was quite proud of my son when he first - >> all right. we'll leave that there. this is eric brady in "usa b

today" sports. he's a sports columnist for "usa today." he writes why james harrison is wrong. participation trophies don't warp kids' outlook. perhaps this is news to james harrison, the pittsburgh steelers linebacker, who won't a recent instagram post who said he returned his kids' participation trophies because n they hadn't earned g them. kids always know the score, even when it's not being kept. and then the world went nuts. much of the sporting press laye nodded in solemn agreement as if a football player with a history of cheap shots is now somehow a paragon of proper parenting. others suggested millennials are singularly unable to cope these days because they grew up believing all those trophies they got for showing up warped

their view of their own specialness. this is nonsense, eric brady writes. kids always know the fastest kid on the playground and the best players on their teams.wi they know the difference betwee. winning and losing and the distance between first place ant last. they do notuse grow up to beli they are winners in life just because they got a tin trophy for finishing fifth in rec mean league basketball. participation trophies were not thought up by kids, and they probably mean more to the self-esteem of parents and is grandparents than to their progeny in the pint-size cleats. is any of this really worth another chapter in the tough-love approach to life? this baby boomer, eric brady writes, knows lots of millennials. mostly smart, happy, well-adjusted young men and women. older generations always find something to harumph about in th youngeris generations. that's all this really is, a belief that things were better

in a past that never was.o not the trophies cost a few bucks tn for a big smile.allen they dofa not cause trauma in later life. woody allen famously said 80% of success is showing up. inscribe that on a participation bobble and consider this tempesu in a trophy like a youth league referee. that's eric brady in "usa today." up next is g ted in flushing, n york. goodreal morning to you. >> caller: yes, good morning. i really appreciate participation in any program, and if that really leads to a m trophy, why not? for example, i put my kids to po work playing tennis.it after they finished, they got their certificate. that certificate now we posted on our refrigerator. it becomes a motivation for theb children. playing em now iss. tennis. he might be a superstar.

nobody knows. but giving a trophy for a child is not against anything. it is their reward because they are behaving and playing, participating. self-esteem motivation. we should encourage, not ca discourage. >> jimmy, lancaster, ohio. what's your view on this? >> caller: well, i have a for different swing here. i don't think it's right for these movie stars to get awardsp and trophies. what are they doing?e hero. they're just acting. or a basketball player or football player that think alic they're a hero. you're not a hero. >> thank you, ma'am. alice is in philadelphia. what's your view on everybody ne gets a trophy?er: >> caller: well, good morning. my view was that i disagreed with it. but i listened to the man prior to thebi man that just spoke.

my opinion may have changed a little bit. but i want to say something so aboutcc another part of that. i have a grandson who plays arsk soccer. he's very good. he playeds in13 a tournament a years back. he's 13 now. but he was voted the most valuable player. i think they had three sessionso that day. he won most valuable player in each session.th the coach denied him mvp in two of the sessions because he saidh someone else deserved that th trophy. i think that way of doing things, it sort of goes with what you're talking about now. s i think that's the wrong way to do. you earn something, and they deny it to you because the othen kids didn't get it. >> that's alice in philadelphia.

now on our facebook page, facebook.com/c-span, you can make comments as well.te here are a couple that have come in. julie says, if they made a legitimate effort, they should get some recognition as opposed to those who did nothing. james harrison is promoteding the idea if they don't come in first, their efforts are worth a nothing. danny says, no child left behind, disagree. this is going to take away page the winners. and a further comment down the . - hopefully i can find it right away. i had it a minute ago. well, we'll come back to it.wh and we'll move on to bill in san francisco. bill,an what do you think? everybody gets a. trophy. >> caller: i think everyone should get a trophy. >> why? >> caller: because the special olympics is an example of a heml

situation in which people , like should -- you know, kids who normally wouldn't feel very gooh about themselves, like schizophrenics and cripples ands people of that nature, you know, have the ability to feel positive about themselves. also, i'll be voting for deez nuts in 2016.ho >> and that's bill in san francisco, california. the comment i was looking for here is from steven.elated it was a little bit related to what bill had to say, at least l the first part of what he had to say, which is, i've been at many special olympics events, and atf everyone at least gets a ribbon, which are somewhat different circumstances than what the player's referring to, but there is a place for such awards. matt is calling in from ev maryland. matt, tro what do you think abo everybody gets a trophy? is this a sense of entitlement?

is this important to encourage participation? how do you feel about it? and matt is gone at this point.s anothesur columnist has writtena about thisdy issue. nancy armour is on the other side of her colleague eric brady. james harrison is right. life isn't always fair, you can work yar hardest, try your best, expend every ounce of energy you have and sometimes things just don't work out the way you hopeh or imagined. that's just the way things go. yet, somewhere along the way, someone had the misguided notion that kids should live in a la-la land where everything is a perfect. there are no hardships orop bbon heartbreaks and you get a shiny trophy or pretty blue ribbon te just for being you. there's time enough to get e, ci acquainted with reality, the thinking goes.ncou in the meantime, children should be praised and raencouraged,

reminded at every turn how propn wonderful they are. everybody gets a trophy kids proponents say children should be rewarded for their efforts, that the prizes give kids incentives to always try their best and persevere. but isn't that what the orange slices and cookies are for? by handing out trophies and medals at every turn, it actually sends the opposite message. essentially telling kids it's enough just to show up. why should a kid strive to improve or put in the extra effort when he or she is treated no differently than the kid who sits in the outfield picking dandelions? or as nfl mvp kurt warner said on twitter on monday, they don't let kids pass classes for just showing up.petiti the benefit of competition isn't actually winning.ashley the benefit is improving -- this is according to ashley merriman, co-author of "top dog." when you're constantly giving a kid a trophy for everything they're doing, you're saying, ie don't care about improvement, i

don't care what you're learning from your mistakes. all we expect is that you are always a winner. this is part of nancy armour's recent column this week on the everybody gets a trophy instagram post that pittsburgh steeler james harrison sent out. joel is calling in from new york. joel, you're on the air.wr what do you think? >> caller: good i morning. well, i was a college athlete. i wrestled in college. i got to that point because i was 5'6" and wasn't winning basketball trophies. i realized through some process of elimination that i was greatd at wrestlings. because i was winning trophies, not

participation awards. >> anything else? >> caller: no, that's it.st: >> all right. ben is in clarksburg, west virginia. >> caller: hey, i'd like to tell you that i think trophies are important to kids because, you know, as long as they're active ts, to they deserve a trophy to keep them off the s streets, to keep them involved in sports. it's a good thing. yes, i know there's an overkillo with, you know, the point that they're trying to make byph not, giving everybody a trophy, but y it's awful nice that once your kids are grown and you look in their room and see all the things you've done with your af kids through the years, it's wt memories not only for your kidsd but after it's all os  with, you can realize that you did a good job or tried to do a good k job as a parent raising your kids. hoecial olympics, they e.deserv the best trophies they can make. >> ben, do you think it's

creating a society of entitlement? >> caller: i think they love to use the word entitlement. when you think entitlements, you think the republicansntit and he they have attacked social to mak security. i think awards is more appropriate to use. the award part of it, to make a kid feel special if they run a a track meet and complete the race and get a ribbon around their neck. they can also look back on their life and say, at one point, i could run a mile or whatever it may be and say, you know, i wase active. i think that's the most re abl important thing. if gode an gives you the talente you're able to go out there and do anything, i think that deserves appreciation. that's the way i look at it. >> jim tweets in, little kids, s let them have a trophy. after that, teach them trophiesf go toro winners only. rick is calling in from

bradenton, florida. rick, what do you think? >> caller: good morning, sir. ga my opinion is not every kid h should get a trophy because it's indicative of a bigger problem that we have of there's too many parents that they try to insulate their children from any kind of disappointment. they have to be taught that disappointment comes with life. there are way too many kids thap they grow up later for life and they don't know how to handle disappointment or anger or something that doesn't go their way becauses they've never been taught that, you know, not everything is going to go your way. life isn't fair. it's never going to be. thank you. >> larry's in texas. good morning, larry. >> caller: good morning. yeah, sure, give a little kid a trophy or something. a lot of kids are so shy, they p

don't want to do anything. then they get the guts to get out there and play. it feels good.if you i wmean, they know they didn't win, but if you hand them something and they feel good about it, get a little pat on the back -- and they're too young to say, well, entitlementd little kidss don't know entitlement. they don't know words like that. they don't know what that means. so give the kids something. let them have a good time and go through the park and have some more fun. make them feel good. >> now, if you are a parent or if you are a sports official whr has been involved in organized a sports for young kids where everybody gets a trophy, we'd love to hear your view point asa well. rich lowery, editor of "the national review" picked up on le this issue and picked up on ere. james harrison's instagram post. here's a little bit of his column, writing about this.

notwithstanding harrison's withering assault and public opinion, the culture of trophie for all in youth sports will endure. the trophy has gone from exceptional reward for excellence to nice gesture to practically an entitlement.icipt when aio cash-strapped little league in oklahoma canceled its participation trophies a couple years ago, one parent complained, thanks little league for failing my son and disappointingwrit him as well. rich lowery goes on to write that there is such a thing as winning and losing and excelling and failing.come if it's okay for kids to understand that. and in fact, if theyo be don't,a they're going toso be shocked b life. there's no reason to try to hide it under a raft of automatic trophies that will never be as valued as something truly extraordinary or truly earned.c: hey, steve. i called them before. it's a weird james in spokane, washington. what's your view? >> caller: hi, steve. i called in before.

it's a weird analogy, but i kind of compare this to calling people heroes. and don't get me wrong, i don't disparage. i know the families go through a whole lot of stuff, but heroes used to be reserved for medal of honor resip yencipients or peop did extraordinary things. so everyone getting a trophy, you know, if someone does extraordinary, then they deserve it. totally anti-politically correct. but if the kid earns it, then there's value in it. >> so at what point do you earn it? >> caller: well, you know, it's the 80% of life is just showing up. if someone does extraordinary -- and even as children, we realize when someone does something extraordinary, right. and that should be -- and this is the analogy on the heroes thing. you know, calling the families heroes and everyone heroes.

i appreciate their sacrifice. i appreciate everything they do, right. but the guy who jumps on the grenade, right, that's a hero. and we all realize that. so everyone getting a trophy, when i was in school, and i'm 50 years old, when i was in school the guy who did something extraordinary got the trophy. but just making the trophy, it kind of diminishes the excellent. does that make any sense? >> have you had kids participate in sports and get a participation trophy? >> caller: no. >> okay. all right. thank you, sir, for your time. gi gil is calling in from jamestown, north carolina. you're on "the washington journal." >> caller: yes, good morning. like some of the other callers, i believe it's okay to give a trophy in the form of a paper

recognition for those participating in sports at a young age, say up until the seventh grade. but after the seventh grade, where things become very competitive, then you give a meaningful trophy. as far as mr. james harrison is concerned, i'm just wondering, how does he reward his kids? does he reward them after a game where their kids have -- where he says, oh, you gave a good hit to that kid and his kids are getting maybe a concussion or the beginnings of brain injury. i find it fascinating he might reward his kids after a game with a hamburger or some sort of verbal reward, at the detriment of his children. that's my comment. thanks. >> gil, have you had kids in sports? we will never know. well, you probably saw or heard about president carter yesterday talking about his cancer

diagnosis. c-span covered that press conference live. here's a portion of what he had to say. >> first, i felt that it was confined to my liver and that the operation had completely removed it. so i was quite relieved. then that same afternoon we had an mri of my head and neck and it showed up it was already in four places in my neck and brain. i would say that night and the next day until i came back up to emory, i just thought i had a few weeks left. but i was surprisingly at ease. i've had a wonderful life. i've had thousands of friends. i've had an exciting and adventurous, gratifying existence. so i was surprisingly at ease. much more so than my wife was. but now i feel it's in the hands

of god, whom i worship. i'll be prepared for anything that comes. >> and that was president carter talking about the next couple of weeks and what he's going to be going through. that full video, the full press conference that he held, he's 90 years old, can be seen at c-span.org. now, back to your calls on everybody get astro if i. this is preston in omaha, nebraska. good morning. >> caller: good morning. i believe that everybody is not created equal. because some are faster, some are just naturally taller, bigger, more built to compete in certain sports than other kids are. now, when they hand those trophies out, you know that first place trophy is always a lot prettier, always a lot bigger. the second place trophy is the

next level. the third place level trophy goes down to the next level. everybody wants that first place trophy regardless. now, if they get a participation trophy, i don't see anything wrong with it because they did show up to compete. there used to be a show trophy back in the day where that person that took fourth place got a trophy or an award. but it's an award that's a lot less than the first, second, third place trophies. i don't psi anything wrong with giving a participation trophy. they participated. >> now, preston, there's a note on the screen that says you have grandkids. have they participated in sports and gotten participation trophies? >> caller: my granddaughter, she's about 6 years old. she does basketball and

gymnastics, but no, she hasn't gotten any participation trophies at all. but that doesn't mean that, you know, she shouldn't get one just for being in -- playing basketball or whatever. but it's on the same level. i can understand what the football player and some of these other callers are saying, that if you give everyone a trophy, in a way it could take away from that drive for them to want to kpeept. but a true competitor doesn't want that little bitty piece of trophy. he may not be happy with it. i remember when i was playing basketball. we were playing for first place. we barely lost the game. i was not very happy with that second place trophy. i was almost about ready to throw it away.

i wanted that first place trophy. so a true competitor is not never going to be happy with the lesser. >> you know what -- >> caller: we're not born equal. some are just born naturally gifted. others are born less gifted, less physically capable. doesn't mean they tried just as hard. >> preston, yesterday when we were discussing this issue in our editorial meeting, one of the issues that came up -- and you mentioned you had a 6-year-old granddaughter. one of the issues that came up is graduation from every class, you know, from kindergarten, from first grade, et cetera. somebody mentioned, well, you used to go to school and graduate 12 years later. are your -- is your granddaughter being graduated in a ceremony from every year she's in school? what do you think about that? >> caller: well, you know, i don't really know if there's a

graduation, like you say. she just started first grade. i don't know if there's a graduation thing from kind kindergarten up to first grade. in my view, i wouldn't see that as a bad thing. if you're making it from the first grade to the second grade, second grade to the third grade and you're actually making it, i don't see any problem with you at the end of the year saying, okay, i made it to the third grade. it's not like you're graduating. no, you graduate from elementary to the middle school, to the high school. from high school, you go to college. but i don't believe that passing kids through school that don't know anything and don't know the basics, i don't think under even get through elementary school without being able to read and write. >> all right. >> caller: it totally messes me up when i see people that are

totally all the way through high school and they don't have these basic skills down. you're not doing them any favors by passing them through. >> that's preston in omaha, nebraska. appreciate your time this morning. by the way, here is a photograph of the trophies that james harrison's sons received for being the so-called best of the batch, next level athletics. this it for their participation. cassie is a parent in newport news, virginia. what do you think about even gets a trophy? >> caller: actually, i disagree with that. we have a daughter and she's participated in several different types of sporting events through junior high and high school. i never felt like she should get rewarded with a trophy unless she competed to that level. oftentimes as i observed just

watching her in practices and different competitions, i could see she wasn't really trying as hard as some of the other children. so i didn't want her to get rewarded for a haphazard effort. i don't think that's the right message. and i would always tell her, look, you need to try harder. so i disagree with just giving out trophies just to appease children or parents or whoever is feeling a little emotional about the child not having anything from participation. i think if we want to do anything for the remaining children who didn't come in first or second or third place, take them out to a pizza party. say, hey, everybody put in a great effort, you tried hard, and just reward them in that regard. they shouldn't -- everybody should not receive a trophy. it waters down what trophies really mean, which is you're

supposed to be the cream of the crop, so to speak. the olympics doesn't give out trophies to all participants, even though they're the best of the best from around the world. only the top three people in each event get a trophy or a medal or what have you. so i think it's not the right message to just give trophies out to kids just for showing up and bringing 80% to whatever it is. >> in james harrison, here's part of his instagram post. this was tweeted out by fox news. i'm not about to raise two boys to be men by making them believe that they are entitled to something just because they tried their best. one opinion tweets in, participation trophies, they break, collect dust, and embarrass some kids who know they lost. it's a business. ray in new jersey. what do you think? >> caller: well, when it comes to sports, it really mirrors

society's cultural expectations. we go to work. if we get the job, we get paid. most of us get minimum or a little above that. then some people get higher salaries for, you know, better skills, better productivity. then of course you know what the ceos get. but that's the same thing with sports. i played baseball most of my life. we had trophies. we got participation level, mvp. somebody who maybe had the most home runs, et cetera, et cetera. one factor people haven't said is that our parents today are paying a lot of money for kids to participate. they want to see the kids go home with something. so that's one of the factors. quite frankly, they also are the participants from the stands. so all those things play a factor in what trophies are given out and what levels and why and that necessarily shouldn't be the case.

but i do think that kids are motivated when they get something to try harder next time to do better. >> randy is calling in from williamsburg, virginia. what do you think about this issue? >> caller: good morning, america. good morning, c-span. i own a small business that's been operating for 15 years, and i'm a fitness education and safety business. i've made 1200 school-site visits over these last years. i disagree because the trophy is really a receipt. it demonstrates the parents put in a lot of effort driving to and from events, games, and practice. it's a receipt for the child having played that sport. and once again, america's losing its focus with sports. we're pumping up individuals through them, and there's really

no data that demonstrates that there's a positive outcome in the elementary, middle, and high school participation. i know i have nagging injuries from my high school sports career. i'm 53 now. they compromise my ability to train children now. so i would say that the trophy's really a receipt, and the cost of these sports, the facilities, many communities are basing their revenue, new revenue streams on sports, k-12 sports. i think it's a little perverted. and we've lost our focus. >> well, randy, it sounds like you're being critical of your personal revenue stream. is that fair? >> caller: well, i don't play games with childrens' health. i'm a fitness professional.

we do fitness. so i elevate and sustain heart rate. and i do it in a fun, healthy, educational, and safe way. >> so the kids who participate in your programs, do they all get a trophy? >> caller: no, they get education, health and safety. and i have kids beating down my door to get to my program when i'm at a school site. when there are all these other activities that are fun, they have a physical outcome. you'll never see any program that can take like mine and sustain a heart rate at 110, 120 beats and have a conversation with a 4-year-old and 5-year-old about the resting heart rate and

accelerated heart rate. you can't teach children about vocabulary, their body, or math and science and what their body is doing while they're doing these activities. so i created these mobile fitness facilities. i've been on the national mall. i'm one of the only businesses in america. i think i'm the only one that the cdc has published as a public health program. it is common for me to show up at a school and train 500 children in a six-hour school day with 30 stationary bikes in a 50-foot trailer. >> okay. we're going to put on the screen the trophies that james harrison's sons won for participating. what do you think about the presentation of these trophies, and what do you think about the fact james harrison returned

them? >> caller: well, i think parents need to take a more focused role in these activities their children are participating in. i'm glad he's voiced his way of raising his children. it sounds like he's very involved. and that's -- you have some folks that are just way over the top, and then some are just going through the paces. what you have to have is a professional that can capture those children who are disenfranchised, standing around, playing with their baseball mitt, or their mind is somewhere else. you've got to grab them. you've got to get those chemicals in their brain rolling. and i can assure you that i

don't care how -- whatever role that kid plays in his school, whether he's the physical one or the smart one, they will participate. so you have to give them an opportunity, all children, to get on a field that has something that offers all of them, whether they're tired o or a little grumpy, something that will grab them. regardless of their previous i'm in the day, this elevates them. this gets those chemicals going. >> all right. that's randy in virginia. thanks for your time this morning. this guy tweets in, everyone gets a trophy for just showing up? didn't realize we were talking gop presidential hopefuls. bonnie in florida, what do you think about this issue? >> caller: well, number one, i think -- i agree but i disagree. i'm not going to get into that respect of it.

but certain children -- i think a lot of it is based on parents. every parent is different. i agree with the lastdyñ caller. i did not have my kids participate in athletics. i did have personal trainers or athletic programs in gyms. i think there isn't a lot of fairness in athletic programs. there is favoritism. and for everyone getting a trophy, knowing that they -- that's not necessarily something i agree with. i think it depends on the child. some children need additional self-esteem building. not all parents are great self-esteem builders. some of them go over the top. some of them don't do it at all. so it depends on the child. that kind of trophy is ridiculous. that's absolutely absurd. i think if you're going to get a participation trophy, it should be designated as that, a

participation. some children don't like to participate, so when they finally step out and do participate, they learn, you know, team building and sometimes trying things out of your comfort zone work. so you get a little dollar-store trophy, things like that maybe. those huge ones, that's just absurd. they're bigger than probably some super bowl cups. i mean, that's crazy. >> that's bonnie in florida. bob on our facebook page posts, don't tie trophies to self-esteem. they're intended to recognize the winner of a competition. that's why they don't give tin and copper medals for olympics. mike is in mt. sterling, kentucky. hi, mike. >> caller: hello this morning. i agree, i think they should give them kids a trophy for starting out to show that they can participate in sports. i think it's a good thing.

>> and that's mike in mt. sterling, kentucky. up next is larry in tennessee. >> caller: hello. >> hi, larry. >> caller: hi. me and my wife are past cub scout and boy scout leaders. we've dealt with kids considerably. i think it's okay to have both participation and recognition. i think at a young age, a participation trophy is fine. they get out, they run, they get

an idea what teamwork is about. but i think recognition for what you do is good too. i think the boy scouts, the cub scouts, they earn merit badges. they work hard. they get it checked off. at the meeting, they come up with their parents and they get a badge. in i think it's a way to show advancement. >> larry, did you find the kids liked the participation recognition? >> caller: i did, and my oldest boy has still got his soccer participation medal or little,

you know, recognition trophy. it's the first thing you get. i hate to see these kind of -- at a young age, trying to politicize the kids' minds and whether their participate or they're recognized for -- there's only one -- they don't get -- you just -- you don't get recognized along the way for what you have done that you have to just be part of a team. and if your team is good enough, then it gets recognition. a lot of times, you think about it, the trophy goes to the school or the coach. it goes to somewhere else.

they don't have them in their homes, you know. it's a team effort, and the school or the college, they get it. whereas in cub scouts, the individual is recognized, and they put on a sash. the kids walk around and not everybody has the same amount on their sashes. and they stand out. and they ought to stand out. >> all right. that's larry. we're going to stop there. take a couple more calls and read this tweet as well. like a previous tweeter, virginia texan politicized his tweet, giving trophies for participation trains young democrats to be takers who demand free stuff. bob is in philadelphia. bob, everybody gets a trophy.

>> caller: i disagree there. i think when i was growing up, the best thing you could have was a team jacket, showed you were part of the team. the trophies went to the best participants, but the jacket was more important, to be able to wear that and show that you were a team participant that way. >> and finally rich is calling in from pittsburgh. this is where this whole story began, huh, rich? >> caller: yeah, good morning. you know, i think the one caller was misinformed. he talked about the winners getting larger trophies. a story was on hbo's "real sports." the leagues they talked to, they didn't keep score and all of the trophies were exactly the same. so i think that's -- and i think this is robbing children of coping skills. i'll give you two examples. number one, they did a study about 50 years ago and asked 9 or 10-year-old children if they

thought they were special. they said the results of the survey were that 20% thought they were special and 80% thought they were average. they did the same study not too long ago and they said that 80% of the children thought they were special and only 20% did not. i think this manifests itself in different ways. an example of that is when i was a kid and you were dating a girl, if she breaks up with you, you pick yourself up, dust yourself off, mope around for a couple weeks, and move on. i think you're seeing more and more examples now of these young boys, these teenagers that when the girl breaks up with them, they come back and assault the girl or they say, if i can't have you, no one can. i think that is how it's kind of robbing kids of coping skills. that's my take on it, anyway. >> so what kind of play is james harrison's instagram post getting in pittsburgh? >> caller: i don't really think it's that big of a deal. he's not a big, you know -- i'm not a fan of his because he also

would not go to the white house to see president obama because he's not a big fan of president obama and i am a big fan of president obama. so i kind of dismiss what harrison says anyway. so not a big fan. >> that's rich in pittsburgh. thanks to everybody who participated in that conversation. "washington journal" is on the air 365 days a week. it's august. it's a little bit slower here in washington. we thought we'd spend a little time, and we appreciate the enthusiastic level of participation in that segment. well, coming up, we're going to turn our attention to politics with steve forbes. after that, we're going to be talking about synthetic drugs with the attorney general of d.c. those are a couple of the segments coming up this morning in this edition of "the washington journal." but first, we want to show you a little bit more from jimmy carter's news conference yesterday on his cancer diagnosis.

[ no audio ] >> so we have a good and harmonious family. i would say the haven for our lives has been in georgia. i plan to teach sunday school this sunday and every sunday as long as i'm physically and mentally able in my little church. we have hundreds of visitors who come to see the curiosity of a politician teaching the bible.

so i'll continue that. i've just had a lot of pleasures. >> and anything you wish that you had not done or that you'd done differently? >> i wish i'd sent one more helicopter to have rescued them and i would have been re-ele re-elected. [ laughter ] >> that may have interfered with the foundation of the carter center. if i had to choose between four more years and the carter center, i think i would choose the carter center. >> "washington journal" conti e continues. >> now, joining us from our new york studio is steve forbes. we'll be talking about politics, the gop field. if you would, give us your assessment of the race so far. >> what you've seen is an interest in the race. i think you will see it on the democratic side as well. it is absolute intense, absolutely unprecedented. th first debate, republican debate to get 24 million viewers

is phenomenal. part of it is what damaged trump did entering the race, he st stirred things up. i think that got a lot of interest in that debate. what it underscores, there's a lot of dissatisfaction where the country is at and economy is at and overseas and you see it in the bernie sanders on the democrat side. not as much as republican party and this democrat socialist in vermt, ahead of hilary clinton, moving up in the national polls. people want big change and they're very unhappy where we are today. >> mr. forbes, this is a rather indelicate question. what are the drawbacks of a wealthy man running for president? >> in donald trump's mind, zero. when you run, no matter what your background, when you go in

that arena, you will expect brick bats. it's like the nfl. it's a contact port. they will say you're out of touch or no achievement what do you know about making things happen. they'll find something. it's part of the field you're getting into. you're doing it voluntarily. if you don't like getting bruises, don't get in this ring. >> you ran for president twice. did you suffer those brick-bats? >> of course. i called it the hazing process of american politics. in 1996 when i started to gain traction. there was the honeymoon period for a week or two, national press oohs and ahs, great str e strides and promoting the flat tax and the like and then overnight it turned nothing you did was right and they found something wrong everyday. what the american people look at

in that process, can you handle the pressure? in the presidency, you get stuff thrown at you comes at you everyday. how do you handle the hard hi hitting unexpected things in that arena. >> are they discussing the issues you think are important so far? >> in the first debate. i think it will change in the second debate and there was inadequate discussion of the economy, hardly any mention of the tax code and financial reserve and tax credits and markets hurting small and new businesses and very little discussion of health care. i think that will change in the second debate and i think you will find participants more active that were less passive in the first debate and all know if they don't show well in this debate they will in effect be thrown off the island. i think you will see the

candidates have a lot more specific proposals and what is on the candidates mind. >> let's put the phone numbers up in case you want to participate. get through on thecannot phone lines and still want to make a comment, try if you can't get through on the phone lines, still want to make a comment, try twitter@c-spanwj is our handle. steve forbes is editor of forbes and ran for president in 2000 and written several books as well. what if donald trump gets the nomination for your party, mr. forbes? >> to get the nomination, it's very different from getting an early lead in the polls. to get it you have to show you will unite the party and win

primaries that shows you can bring people together. we're still a long way from that. we have to remember, it's still several months before we have the first contest in iowa. to win a nomination of a political party, you have to show you can bring the different parts of party together. parties in america are unlike what you see in europe and elsewhere, you have groups and people together who have very different interests from one another. one quick example. in a normal economy, you go to iowa, iowa republicans have much more interest as a whole, as a whole in social issues than economic issues. in new hampshire, you go there, you find just the opposite. much more interested in economic issues, hardly any interest in social issues. as a whole. as a generality. so you see dispar rat groups you have to get the nomination and not just a rise in the polls, you have to demonstrate in the

primaries and caucuses you can bring the disparate parties together to get that majority. >> what's your assessment of carly fiorina, another ceo who's running. >> she's demonstrated especially what they call the kitty table to date, the seven that debated in august a couple weeks ago, she demonstrated and put in a very impressive performance. as a ceo, you're accustomed to getting brick-bats and accust accustomed to a lot of pressure and different constituencies nothing like you face in politics. i attended a dinner with fiorini a couple months ago. there was handful of people and they were impressed how she comported herself and answered tough questions. it didn't surprise me she did very well in that secondary debate and i think it's very clear she will be at the adult table so to speak in

mid-september. >> have you endorsed and are you going to? >> no. i'm with a couple of several other people like art laugher and steve moore, we've been putting together meetings with ve various people and particular candidates discussing making changes of the horrific tax code and economic issues. we agreed when we started to do these events we would not endorse until after we had an opportunity and people had an opportunity to be with -- talk to all of the candidates. so that process is still unfo unfolding. i don't expect to do anything until at least around christmas time. >> are many of them friends of yours? >> i've known many over the years, some better than others, yes, most of them are not strangers. >> dede frederick tweets in, dr. carson is very popular and pl e places second in many polls.

what are your thoughts on his candidacy? >> i think dr. carson's rise -- he did well among the republican base in that first debate, dr. carson, i think also exemplifies deep dissatisfaction with politics as it is today with the present people who are in politics and people want a big change. i think has great knowledge, quiet demeanor, has impressed people as somebody who has done substantive things in his life and not just made speeches. one of the things i think, by the way, that came out of that first debate even though the whole focus is on donald trump is the republican bench is very deep and very strong. you had a lot of impressive people up there. i think you will get more of an impression how strong that bench is on september 16th debate. that's why the situation of the republican party in particular is so fluid. you have a lot of people who are

very very plausible. that's why carly fe iorina has gone up and dr. carson has gone up and governor kasich of ohio has had a rise. >> let's take some calls. steve forbes is our guest and matt is calling in on our republican line. hi, matt. >> good morning. good morning, mr. forbes. >> caller: you were saying about brit-bats and hilary clinton was the first anchor baby and the term anchor baby has been used for decades. all of a sudden, it's an offensive term to hilary clinton. n now, when she was in a position to actually say something about it, she didn't. but now all of a sudden and everybody knows what anchor babies are, no two ways about it, but jeb bush and donald

trump are being condemned for it for saying what the truth is. you know what, it is a time for the republicans to start coming to the gun fight with a gun instead of a knife. they had started to back in the day s of newt gingrich. now it seems like they're backpedaling and hem hawing and apologizing for telling the truth. i'd like them -- what you said is true. i'd like to see somebody stand up. i'm not saying i'm a trump fan, but i'll tell you what, i love his attitude. >> whoops, i'm sorry, matt, i thought you were finished. mr. forbes, any comment from matt. >> i think that exemplifies, the d dissatisfaction. we've had the worst sharp down turn since the 1930s, a feeling things are falling apart around

the world and things are not going right here at home and labor market not as strong as it should be. people are frustrated and also looking for new faces. now, as the caller indicated, doesn't mean he at the end of the day, or when the primaries come he'll end up voting for donald trump or dr. ben carson or somebody else but he wants a vigorous debate out there. i think you will see a very vigorous debate not only on immigration, you will see it on taxes and spending and see it on the huge spew of regulations we've had that are crushing small businesses. i think you will have very very lively encounters in the next three or four debates. >> is there a republican candidate for president you would not support at this point? >> no. i'm looking at the field. i want to see what they put on the table. i also want to see how well they handle the pressure when those brick-bats really come flying at them. ronald reagan demonstrated he never lost his demeanor, which

is one of his great characteristics but he demonstrated he could take the pressure and take the criticism and not lose sight of the purpose for his candidacy. that's, by the way, going back in history, one of the mistakes ross perot made running as an independent in 1992, was pulling out of the race and then coming back in. you can't do it. if you're in it, you're in it until you either win or you're out. >> travis is a republican in detroit. hi, travis. >> caller: hello. speaking of new faces, i've generally voted republican over the years, but recently i've become disillusioned with the party. i found and independent candidate that's been getting press lately called deez nuts. i wonder what you think and his chances are. >> you want to address that, mr. forbes? >> no. but i think you will see -- by

the way you will see more, i think, coming on the democrat side as there is a feeling certificat secretary clinton is vulnerable. there will be plenty of colorful stories and lively people out there in this process. >> approximately 600 people have declared their intention and filed to run for president at this point. do you think joe biden is going to get in the race? >> i think there's a very good chance he will do it. i think there are a lot of people in the white house who would like to see him do it, continue the legacy, would have seemed unthinkable six months ago. i think we've seen already you will see a lot of unanticipated things happening in this campaign. john kerry, depending what happens to that iran agreement may get in the race. there ae's talk about al gore, which will lead to a lot of fodder for the comedians. they've already had a lot of it

from the republican side. i heard one the other day saying look at all these potential unannounced democrat candidates, all are eligible for social security. what does that tell you? there will be plenty of grist for the mill for the traditional journalists and comedians as well. >> deez nuts has been identified as a 15-year-old farm boy in iowa, named brady olson. next call -- >> sadly, 15, you've got to be 35 under the constitution to be president. >> robert calling in on our independent line from greenville, north carolina. go ahead. >> caller: good morning, gentlemen. mr. forbes i'd like to ask you what you think about citizens united and also i would like to ask you who was worse when donald trump says he has bribed all kinds of politicians with

money donations, is he the worst guy for bribing the politicians or for the politicians taking the bribes? thank you. >> on citizens united which is a supreme court decision saying unions can set up organizations to independently support candidates, i think that case simply is a way station to finally removing all the -- a lot of the campaign restrictions put in the after math of watergate in the 1970s which made our election laws and i experienced this and almost as con voluted as our tax0i÷ code. i hope we get either through the supreme court or acts of congress, get rid of those restricti restrictions. you should be allowed to give what you want to a candidate, post it online, instant these days and stop all this con voluted stuff, just make it open, transparent and be done

with it. i hope we get to that instead of the complicated way you have to do it today. >> what do you think about what donald trump had to say when he said, yeah, i give politicians money and they do what i want? he said that in the debate essenti essentially. >> i'm sure there are times he wishes they would do what he wanted. what he was saying, i think this is one of the reasons why people looking at his candidacy, what he's saying, know a lot of times money is given for access. you want a place at the table, you have to be a player, pay for play. if you allow absolute openness so people can absolute see right away who's giving what to whom so you can ask questions about it, questions need to be asked, they should do it. when he was asked for an example of where his contributions he

helped him, he could only say he got hilary clinton to come to his wedding. that was the only example he cited. i'm sure in the next debate, aside from weddings, what else did you get out of this? >> is mr. trump a friend of yours? >> yes. i've neen known donald trump fo years. as you know, his father was major real estate developer in new york. donald trump as a very young man broke in from the -- into manhattan in the 1980s. i got to know him way way way back then. >> are your daughters at all interested in politics, mr. forbes? >> we have five daughters, several grandchildren, three grandchildren and, no, none of them are interested in politics. a couple of them follow it intently but none have exhibited any appetite for it. they saw it, they're glad they saw it but it did not entice them to enter the arena.

>> mark in chester, connecticut, democrat, hi, mark. >> caller: good morning. thanks for taking my call. i want to reiterate what mr. forbes said about the lack of coverage for bernie sanders. he's always labeled as a soci socialist democrat. we never hear of all the capitalistic republicans or democrats. it's label that is kind of misconstrued, i think. when we were a country that was founded on the people, being a socialist type, which means -- i think bernie sanders is this chairman of the ways and means, so we've seen the squandering of wealth and greed that can happen with a purely capitalistic approach, which is becoming stronger and stronger. we need someone that's there to speak for the people and he speaks to the people.

a lot of people get the wrong impression when he's called the sociali socialist. i wish they would drop it and leave it as democrat. i think he has a lot of great things to say and needs some more airtime. thank you for my call. >> mr. forbes. >> in terms of the label, "soci "socialist," bernie sanders called himself a social iist in vermont, when he runs for the senate. before that, from congress, the congressional representative from vermont. on the ballot, you have republican, democrat and soci socialist. he filed as a socialist. he caucuses in the senate with the democrats, they like his approach and let him in the caucus, put him on as a member of their various committees, slots they have on various committees. that socialist label, bernie sanders puts on himself. that's not something the press did or his opponents did. he called himself that on the

ballot. >> bernie sanders will be live tonight on c-span at 7:00 p.m. from south carolina. he's holding a town hall meeting in columbia, south carolina. we will carry that live. afterwards, senator sanders will join us for a call-in program. you'll have a chance to talk directly to senator sanders, 7 p.m. live tonight eastern time on c-span. stella, from miami. you're on with steve forbes. >> caller: good morning, mr. forbes. >> good morning. >> caller: i'll give you a little background. this is in reference to your run in 2000. i was a volunteer then in miami. >> thank you. >> caller: you're welcome. the reason i did this is due to the factor that i was caught in occupied china as a child. my father was u.s. navy, long story. he served under admiral harry

yarnell who planned, carried out a mock successful raid on pearl with yamamoto observing and co y copying it which fdr ignore eigo i never vote democratic. the question i had was as a volunteer, why did you back out of that event, your run? i remember dorn nan and keys, both of whom i have photographs. i just need to know that and whether this might happen in this next election. >> in terms of both the 2000 race and 1996 race, when you lose, you don't get the vote, you don't carry on. even though we came close on some of those early contests in 2000, close was not good enough. when you don't win, you will pull out and lick your wounds and move on. that's the nature of the game. it wasn't something i wanted to pull out of or voluntarily

pulled out of, the votes weren't there. >> jean from ohio tweets in to you, mr. forbes, do you agree with the gop candidates who seem to agree on one thing, to privatize public education if he elected president? >> i believe in terms of education parents should have a choice. in nevada for example has put ainu law where parents can in effect have a -- whatever you call it, a could you please pon where they don't feel their particular school in their district meets the particular needs of their child, they can put that child in another school. one of the things we're discovering is one size does not fit all. that a particular educational environment good for one kid may not work for another kid. there are a lot of kids who thrive in the single-sex schools, rather than coed schools. we have seen it with our

daughters. we have five kids, five kids all adults now. each one is very different and what works for one may not work for one another. it's not privatizing, giving people a choice. it also gives people more a choice if you don't go to a neighborhood that happens to have a good school, you suffer, that should not be the case. regardless of where you live, you should be able to put your kid in a school that needs that kid's needs, especially in this high-tech age, we're discovering again, one science does not fit all for kids. we need in terms of methods and schools through diversity and education with young kids so they can get what they need. >> steve forbes, at one point in your runs for president, you were pretty much in front of the pack. you were in first or second place in opinion polls. what's that feeling like? >> it's a very pleasant feeling. you hope it can last.

but i remember when it happened in 1996, i remember we were sa saying, this is great, we're moving up. i read enough history to know those things don't necessarily last. this one didn't. usually, when you move ahead, you do go through that hazing period, you do get threat brick-bats and again, that's part of the american political system. we don't have a parliamentary system such as dan or britain or other european countries do, where you know the candidates for high office well in advance. we're a big continental nation. we see the process unfolding now in the republican party. i think eventually among the democrat. you have a lot of people runn g running, but people want to get to know them and they want to see if they can handle the job, handle the heat in the kitchen, as harry truman put it. >> what do you think about the fact iowa, new hampshire is still first and second, when it

comes to this nominating process? >> well, again, i think that actually, even though i didn't win the process, i think it's actually not a bad process because in both states, you get very involved in what they call retail politics even though you're running for president. so you do get to know people, you do get to know issues, you do get to know concerns on a personal basis what you do not get through position papers or reading polls or looking at -- scrolling the internet. face to face, you get a real feel for it. iowa, you have to demonstrate you can put together demonstrations and put those force together for you and new hampshire is a traditional primary, but, again, you have to demonstrate going throughout the state you can win that support with people looking at you very closely. they're not impressed with candidates because they see them all the time. you don't get in a bubble in those states.

so the system is unlike any other, but i haven't seen a better one around the world yet. >> kathy. independent. chesapeake hill, massachusetts. go ahead. >> caller: good morning, mr. forbes. i would like to ask you if your political views are more conservative than your father, malcolm, and i have a brief comment about what you said about the schools. i think that that's true. but i think in these privileged communities, like my own, we need to integrate more fair hou housing, so that people are able to move into these affluent a a areas and where there are better, much better public schools. of course, the more affluent the children tend to go to the

private schools. i would like to know about your dad, malcolm, and how that compares with your views, and -- >> all right, kathy. i think we've got it. thank you very much, steve forbes. >> my father had very diverse views on a lot of subjects. i think i persuaded him on some things, like simplifying the tax code well before i got into politics myself. but one of the amazing things about him each day he always had a fresh take on things. he taught us as kids -- i was one of five children -- taught us as kids to come to our own conclusi conclusions. we would have vigorous argument is around the table, especially with one of our younger brothers. even though he was very for forceful, very forceful, he appreciated when you could make an argument that would make him

change his mind. probably, he died, sadly, 25 years ago, so i have no idea what he would have opinions on these issues today. i would probably very much appreciate hearing because he had a unique way of looking at things. that's one of the reasons why we -- our family misses him. >> what about the housing issue? the public housing issue that caller raised? >> well, you shouldn't be having the federal government forcing people to move or not move or trying to upset local communities. i think on the exhibitions thing, again as nevada is starting to do and see if other states follow suit, give parents the means regardless where they live or their circumstances, they can try to get a school or schooling method that best meets the needs of their particular children. you don't have to have -- say we must build and apartment build

hearing so people can attend a certain school. give people choice of movement. people can live where they want and people should be able to go to the schools again that meet the needs of their kids. , evenon burke tweets in to guey though we have a troubled economy today and i think that is going to change in the next couple of years, we have enough wealth in this nation. to meet the obligations of social security for those on the row graham now and those who are going to go on the program and 10-15 years. the real problem comes with younger people, teenagers, people in their 20's and 30's, there for will not be them if the system, pay-as-you-go system, will not be there for them if we continue on this ut current course.got peoplewo on social security, abo

to go on it, don't worry, you o will get your benefit. for younger people what we should do is phase in, i proposed this 20 years ago, have your own personal account where with properac regulations a certainly amount of payroll tax goes into your account, you own it, not the federal government.p y you -- the more you earn, you'l end up that way, even if you don't go in the stock market, you'll end up, by the time you o wish to retire. the nice thing is you choose 60 when you want to retire whether you want to do it at 60 or 90, you make the choice. that way, if something happens to you,to w those assets go to whoever you want them to go to. right now, when you leave this life, leave this existence, all the money you put in the social security, the politicians keep it. i think this would turn, over time, what is a liability today into an asset.dicare

medicare, medicare has to be part -- i think the changes aree already beginning, again on medicare, we can meet the current medicare obligations for the next 10 to 20 years. i again take issue with some of my colleagues and the republican party on that, i think it can be done. don younger people you have a problem and there we need a more patient oriented system where s you start to get real entrepreneurs coming in as nevea before, providing health care, more health care at a lower f il cost. we seelasi little pieces of it laser surgery for the eyes where it costs less than it did 10 ort 12 years ago because you have those entrepreneurial force at work. we don't havein m time to get i the ways you do it. you put a more patient oriented system. the bottom line on this, ents a patients are not the real customers in health care today, it's all third party, whether it's the insurance company, the government, the employer, the patient is not the real customer. that's going toge change and it

starting to change. when it does, i think the ge problems huge seemingly insurmountable, problems of medicare for younger people aret going to disappear. the end i'm writing a book on that, by the way. >> when is that coming out? >> the end of november.at. >> ken is in deltona, florida, m democrat.ller: >> caller: good morning, mr. forbes. >> good morning. >> caller: my question is about the republican governing of the economy. i've been around since 1948. without exception every republican president has had a recession during their recess administration. some of them horrendous 198 recessi recessions, like the '82 and 2007 recession, and i don't want you to blame it on the democrats because eisenhower's recession . was in 1958, while in his

administration and george w. bush's recession was in 2007, well into his administration ih with republican houseat and sene for the most part. so that's what i think about it. >> well, in terms of the recession, first of all, you ceo didn't mention the 2000-2001 toa recession. i began to feel that one was ou bill clinton was leaving office.was we you can blame itak on any you want, but the economy was wea n weakening, visibly weakening in late 2000. but to your point, in terms of good economics, that's not a partisan matter. i think the previous administration, republican ing f administration made a huge mistake in allowing the weak weakening of the dollar done by the u.s. treasury department, s the federal reserve.ences it haddadi sass tremendo desass

consequences and wouldn't have n had that if the dollar hadn't been undermined in early 2000.ud and a democrat gave kennedy a bill for a major tax cut. kennedy did not muck around witt it. he said the dollar should be as good as gold and 1981-82 and reagan killed it with the that r federal reserve head and we got the great '80s and '90s because of reforms reagan pushed. in terms of taxes, if a democrat wants to have a flat tax, i would cheer. if a democrat wants a stable ofa dollar, stable in value instead of what the fed is doing now, ew treating it like a yo-yo, which is very disruptive, i would erms applaud it. there are no monopolies in terms of good policy. that's why i'm looking at, i

think, the republicans right r now, candidates recognize the mistakes made in the 2000s and d think some of them are starting to put some very good proposals out there, particularly on the tax side.s tweets we're trying to encourage that. >> tweeting in, i agree under current health care, medicare, medicaid, patients are not the real customers, third parties are.om s next call for steve forbes comes from shawn in cleveland, republican line. hi, shawn. shawn is gone.y about sorry about that.ller barry is in new hampshire, independent. >> yes, sir, good morning, mr. forbes. the last time i saw you face to face you were running for president in new hampshire and we had some discussions about eliminating mandatory age based retirement for airline pilots. >> right. now, you're planning to get together with other candidates to see who is worthy of support, that you would broaden this to e

eliminating a mandated age if i retirement for everyone in the s federal service and out of the t federal service. if i had been able to continue to work as an airline pilot much as i don't like to pay taxes i would have been paying taxes ano contributing ton social securi and instead of drawing from social security drawing on society, i think regardless of any's party or affiliation, if they want to work, they should be able to work and contribute to the general welfare . i hope that your position hasn't changed and that you will continue to85#ñ support this.ry >> we'll get a comment in just a minute, barry. very quickly, do you make a point of trying to meet as many of the candidates as possible in new hampshire, and which way are you leaning, as of today? >> caller: well, i'm -- somewhas of an independent. can. i try to meet and listen to as many candidates as i can.er.

i see things i like in people ae diverse as bernie sanders, rand paul, raffle nader. these people setend to be mave k mavericks as i think steve was and still is. they all bring something to the table and although i'm not really a fan of donald trump, nd but there again, he gets a lot of support and attention becauso he's not one of the politics as usual people, as for example, hilary clinton and jeff bush seem to be. >> thank you, sir. steve forbes. >> well, in terms of retirement, i think at the time, pilots had to retire at the age of 60, which was ridiculous, because other countries including israel had higher retirement ages. it's been raised since then.ntay in terms of that, where you havt a fiscally and mentally dema demanding job, if you take a ph test every few month psych lok t

lok -- psychologically, physical, you can do the job you should bo able to do it. the only place you should have fixed retirement executive positions and corporation tries to bring in new people.wh at the very top, yes, i can seee having a retirement age you go and do something else and let the others move in, younger people move in. in terms of like for a pilot, no, i think that should be dependent on your own capabilities and not an e le arbitrary arage.19 we've learned a lot since the 1950s when that pilot rule was put in. in terms of people's capabilities as they get older. >> what about the significance of politics as usual versus maverick, as barry put it? >> well, mavericks, barry calls them, oftentimes bring new ideas in.debate and change the course of debate. so in temps of flrms of flat taa

beens evacuaadvocating a numbe candidates putting that on the table again. t rand paul has already done it u and others doing it, even thougm the u.s. hasn't done it over 30 countries around the world have put in such a system and it's worked fairly well.tues o yes, there's always a place, cld that's one of the virtues of the american system, it's not a closed shop. go to britain, for example, it is almost impossible for somebody not a professional politician to break into that pn system. in the u.s. it's wide open.s a d i think that's a good thing, t because when thingso are not working, people want new soluti solutions. >> david in golds borrougborough carolina, a few minutes left with our guest.ere >> caller: good morning, mr. forbes. >> good morning, david. >> caller: i remember when you were running for president, youh tried to include everyone into

your campaign regardless of race and everything. as of right now, it seems as though every republican is scared to discuss race. i don't see many minorities at the republicans meetings. they all think republicans are racis racists. i'd like to know what your thought is on that.d you i remember when you were running you tried to include everyone in your campaign. so, i just think because they're not willing to talk about ra racism, that that is hurting poi them capolitically. thank you. t i'll wait for yourha answer. thank you. >> thank you and thank you for calling in. i think that this gets to what we were discussing earlier, eare political partr.ies must includc many people if they're going to win national elections in this

country. on the republican side it didn'o come up in that first debate. candidates such as rand paul have been doing a lot of outreach. i know governor john kasich of a ohio not becay has done a lot of outreach, when he ran for re-election as governor he did extremely well among minoritiese because of thaent outreach. several candidates know this and been working on it. i hope they continue to do so.d people want to hear the messaget you have to get the message to everybody if you want to govern this great country. >> is immigration and economic issue?igration >> immigration covers -- it's . not just economics, social and everything else. one of the things i think will l happen as a result of this, you will not get anything from congress in the next year or so, but when you get a new president in 2017, one of the things, a couple of candidates mentioned in the first debate, one of thec things that has tour be done, w have to overhaul and simplify

our current immigration system. if you play by the rules to get in this country you often end up in a t legal limbo twilight zont they lose your files, you wait for years and go through hell to do it. that's not right. people who try to play by the rules shouldn't be punished.ion that's one first step among others in terms of dealing with our immigration challenge. >> finally, mr. forbes, how do you think john boehner and mitch mcconnell are doing here in ice washington? >> well, i wouldn't -- i'm not b going to call them names -- they're nice guys.ive. k -- i was hoping they'd be more aggressive. i'm trying to be polite here, in terms of pushing some needed changes and some abuses, regulatory abuses of this administration. i think that's partecia of the frustration out there, especially when you control both houses of congress they haven'te innovative ways ere is getting some of these issues ho:

dealt with. we ap there's still time for them to do it, i hope they do.we >> steve forbes, as always, we appreciate you coming and it. talking to our viewers and we look forward to having you back on the "washington journal."c >> thank you, peter. appreciate it. we will turn our attention now to synthetic drugs. att coming upor next is karl racine the attorney general of the citn of washington d.c. and wa e wilt talk to him about synthetic drugs and synthetic marijuana and its affect nationally. that's coming up next on the "washington journal." >> this sunday night on q&a, curt >> this sunday night on q&a, 20-year-old college student kirk deon has been visiting graves of presidents and vice president since he was 9 and documents his adventures on his website.

historic sites. >> one grave site everybody had trouble getting to that wants to do that is the rockefeller grave. >> yes. nelson rockefeller, vice president for ford. >> how did you do it? >> we were able to get through what my father describes as an act of god. my father walked farther down the perimeter and saw this gigantic tree had fallen and crushed the fence. he went in and actually saw nelson rockefeller's grave and decided he would have to get me there fairly quickly after that. >> sunday night at 8:00 eastern and pacific on c-span q&a. >> our road to the white house coverage of the presidential candidates continues live from the iowa state fair on c-span, c-span radio and c-span.org as the candidates walk the fairgrounds and speak at the des moines register's vote box. this morning, it's senator ted

cruz. on saturday, republican gover r governors chris christie at noon and bobby jindal at 1:00. join the twitter conversation t at #dmrsoapbox. c-span 20 sewn, ta16, taking yo road to the white house. >> with the senate in its august break we feature book tv prog m programming week nights in primetime on c-span2 starting 8:00 p.m. eastern. for the weekends,qubq here are w book tv special programs. saturday, live from jackson, mississippi, for the inaugural mississippi book festival beg beginning 11:30 a.m. eastern discussions on harper lee, civil rights and the civil war. saturday, september 5th, live from the nation's capitol for the 15th annual live book festival and in depth program with former second lady and senior fellow at the american enterprise institute, lynne

cheney. book tv. television for serious readers. "washington journal" continues. host: we want to introduce you to karl racine, >> "washington journal" continues. >> now, we want to introduce you to karl racine, the attorney general for the city of washington did. he is joining us to talk about synthetic drugs. general racine, what is a synthetic drug? >> sure, peter. a synthetic drug is a chemical compound, normally manufactured as far away as in china, manufactured into a powdery substance, illegally shipped over to the united states, mixed in with solvents and then spr sprayed on dried plants or tobacco and then ingested into the body. these compounds are volatile, inconsistent, erratic and, fr k frankly, they cause very violent

reactions when people ingest them. >> when we say they're sprayed onto a plant, are we talking spray eed onto a real marijuana plant. >> let me destroy a misnomer. oftentimes these synthetic drugs are called synthetic marijuana. in fact, the chemical compound has nothing to do with marijuana. all it is, as i said, is a chemical compound turned into a solvent sprayed on any dried 34r57 plant, not necessarily marijuana and consumed usually by inha inhallation. >> what is in these compounds? what kind of chemicals are being us used. >> that is part of the problem. originally used were taught to mimic thc. nowadays the chemicals are uncertain. even the scientific community is uncertain as to the base chemic chemicals. what we do know however when

folks consume these chemicals in their bodies, all manner of reactions occur. there have been folks who have immediately gone into traumatic coma-like situations, have had heart attacks, and more importa importantly, what generally happens is there is a surge of energy and even violence, violence has occurred and unfortunately innocent bystanders, in many cases have been injured and even killed. >> when you say they're illegally shipped, are they illegal to sell? >> they are absolutely illegal to sell. >> are there statutes on the books here in d.c. that say you cannot sell this compound? >> indeed there are. in fact, initially, prior to 2010, they were not illegal to sell. so the industry, the purveyors of these substances marketed them as an alternative to marijuana whereas we previously

discussed they have nothing to do with marijuana. states and cities like the district of columbia got wise and started passing laws beginning in 2010 to absolutely make these drugs illegal. >> what if the formula gets tweaked just a little bit? >> an excellent question. as you know, chemicals are subject to being tweaked in the laboratory very easily and just in a minor way. when these chemicals get twe tweaked, they oftentimes frustrate the testing in place to uncover whether the chemical is illegal. part of the problem the court has had is to stand up to court in a valid test that holds these drugs to be illegal under schedule one. >> recently, pardon me, c-span covered a forum at the kacato

institute talking about the synthetic drugs and drugs in general. we want to show you a portion and get your reaction to it. >> even highly oppressive society have not been able to stamp out drug use. when you consider our own society, for heaven sakes we're not able to keep drugs out of maximum security prisons. what are our chances of keeping them out of a free and open society? the answer is we have no chance of doing that. what do we do? do we ignore the problem? not necessarily. there are things we can do. the goal should be to channel the trade in these occurrences as well as other illegal drugs into legal channels, into the hands of reputable businesses.

that means requiring standards of labeling and dosage so customers know what they're getting. then, as citizens of a free society they get to make their own decisions. >> that's a very provocative piece by the speaker at the cato institute. talking about chemical drugs we're speaking of, there should be no discussion of legalization of those drugs. what needs to happen, we need to educate the community about the dangers of this drug and dispel the myth this drug is something akin to marijuana. it absolutely is not. we need to do what we did in the district of columbia and the mayor went in and immediately

shut down businesses in the distri district of columbia if they find these drugs and significant fines also attached. in addition, our office of the attorney general and district of columbia are authorized to bring civil action and shut down businesses up to a year. i'm happy to say we've done that. last year, we've gotten much better at substances and now prosecuting sellers of the substance. it really has to be a law enforcement approach as well as an education approach. let me add, quite responsibly, we were able to work with the korean business alliance, a group that has many many convenience stores throughout the city, they were first to come to the plate and join us and getting the message out in the broader community store merchant community that selling these substances is bad conduct.

>> is it fair to say that these substances sold sometimes as scooby snacks are widely available today in the stridist, that you and i could go to a convenes jeco convenience store an buy this? >> the fact of the matter not withstanding the enforcement the drug is widely accessible and cheap. that's why folks are interested in a cheap volatile substance are attracted to it. another reason why a customers use it is because of again a little gap in testing. everyone knows that if you're using heroin, cocaine or marijuana, those drugs will linger in your system and a t t testing process will reveal it. marijuana stays in one's system for 30 days. the truth is that the synthetic drugs, right now, the testing

and the detection is behind what we're doing with the other drugs. i must tell you, though, we're catching up very quickly. >> two final questions before we go to calls, and we've got the numbers up on the screen and had them up there. we've divide our lines region alley, if you live in the east and/or the west, you can see the numbers on the screen, go ahead and dial in and we will begin those calls in just a minute. there's been reports of a seeming spike in crime in d.c. this summer. is there a relationship to the synthetic drug? >> there certainly is an increase in crime. there certainly is adramatic increase in reported cases involving chemical drugs. let me give you a number on that. ten-fold increase is what we're seeing in folks showing up to the emergency room. with symptoms of having ingested chemical drugs. as to whether there's a direct

correlation on that, i won't speak to that issue, i will instead say crime is up, law enforcement is quite active in that regard. one of the areas of emphasis has to be in curtailing the use of chemical drugs. >> finally, 1980s, crack epidemic here in the district. is this comparable? >> i don't believe we're there in terms of comparing what all occurred in the '80s with respect to crack and pcp. i can tell you the government, led by the mayor and council and police chief and all the prosecutors are focused on this in an obsessive way in order to make sure that we don't get to any place like those terrible days in the '80s. >> is there -- is this just a d.c. problem or is this nationwide? >> it's nationwide. the exponential growth in the use of the substance as seen in emergency reports ten-fold increase over last year, is

indeed nationwide. >> let's take some calls. karl racine is our guest, the attorney general for the city of washington d.c. graduate of the university of pennsylvania law school, undergrad, uva. troy is in portland, oregon, please go ahead. >> caller: hello, mr. attorney general. i think this is a mental health issue. i think we're looking at the wrong issue. kids will always try to get something to get high on. i read a report about a thing called teasing. this is going to sound really odd. when two males get together their urine can make you really honking74ñ high. >> you know what, i apologize for that, mr. racine. next call is robin, in pennsylvania. hi, robin. >> caller: hi, how are you? i have something to tell you. my nephew was addicted to heroin. he's been in and out of rehabs

a all -- over and over again. he keeps going back to it. this time he got into trouble with the law. he got into a rehab outside of philly. now, he was in the rehab 13 of the patients in the rehab center got ahold of this synthetic marijuana and all 13 of them smoked it and all went to the hospital all on the same night. how are we going to deal with this? i don't know what else to do. he's in rehab and they got it in rehab. >> look, i'm sorry to hear that story. of course, any suffering from addiction is going to have ups and downs and has to stay with the program and the family must continue to be supportive. this is the problem. the drug is accessible. it's cheap. there is a view out there that the users are not going to be dete detected. that's why what we've got to do is make sure that we're reducing

the amount of supply on the street by enforcing the law on those who would sell and educ e educating people as best we can as to the serious dangers of consumption. >> richard, oak park, illinois, you're on the air. >> caller: hi, thanks for taking the call. i think if we're going to try to have a safer society and society where law enforcement can concentrate on things like violent crime you have to rethink your position about not having a discussion on legalization of substances in general. it shouldn't really amount to what substances we may be talking about. it really amounts to a civil liberties issue. when people want to consume substances that alter their state of consciences. they should be allowed to. if you didn't have such a crackdown on drugs like marijuana, cocaine and heroin, there wouldn't even be market

for synthetic drugs. in any case, due a disservice to the nation and disservice to the youth when you act in an authoritarian manner suggesting it's proper for police to involve themselves in the non-violent activities of adu adults -- we're not talking about children -- that's a different issue -- when chol or druor -- when alcohol or drugs or involved with youths, that's a different issue -- for conse consenting adults you and law enforcement and authorities have no business being in people's business. >> i respect the caller's perspective and in many ways i agree with the caller's central point, nailly that law enforceme enforceme enforcement -- namely that law enforcement and overcriminalization of drug laws can cause more harm to society than benefit. here's the distinction, however. with respect to chemical drugs, the recipe is clear. we know what's going to happen when people ingest it.

it's not just merely a personal use and two adults not harming any. violence as to innocent people occ occurs. innocent people occurs. and when that occurs, the state has to be involved. with respect to legalization of other substances, including marijuana, i think that the caller makes an excellent point. >> karl racine, what is the district's current -- what's the legal status of real marijuana in the district of columbia today? >> in the district of columbia, use of marijuana for medical purposes is legal. use of marijuana for your own purposes at your home is legal. we're in a quandary in the district of columbia because unfortunately the congress of the united states has prevented the district of columbia from

doing what states like colorado have done. and that is quite responsibly regulate marijuana. what should happen is that congress should get out of the way and allow the district of columbia to regulate the legal use of marijuana. we can use the tax benefits that come in to educate folks on proper uses and dangers of drugs. we can put some of that tax money into productive programs that alleviate crime and provide programming for kids. and, thereby, move into what i think is the world of the 21st century when it comes to law enforcement and the use of drugs in america. >> and just to take it further and just to be real clear, do you think that the cocaines and ha heroins, should they be legalized as well in the same manner? would it help law enforcement? >> to be real clear, i think

that the 21st century policing is such that smart prosecution means less of an emphasis on criminalizing conduct, more of an emphasis on mental health and substance abuse. with respect to marijuana, my position is very clear. it should be legal and i think the district of columbia like the state of colorado, should be able to regulate it. >> next call for karl racine, d.c. attorney general. comes from steve in philadelphia. steve, you're on the air. >> yes, good morning. in the opening statement, you mentioned most of the synthetic drugs come from asia. and i would like to know how come congress has not stopped the implementation of this

synthetic drug, and what can we do to halt it from coming into our country. and one more question, i agree with you on the last statement. should be more like colorado and other states, so it could be grown properly, healthier and that's all i have to say. have a nice day. >> thank you very much, caller. in regards to the source of these chemicals, they are being made everywhere. the law enforcement information is that a lot of the drug is manufactured in china. i know that law enforcement is stepping up its effort. i should note the national association of attorney general over the last two years in a bipartisan manner has urged action on the part of congress, and we can certainly use more

law enforcement action to stop the illegal importation of the substance into the united states. >> you talked about how easy it was to hide and to import these drugs because of their powd are. sea of tranquillity tweets in, are these all powder drugs? are any of them liquids or polar enough to be water soluble, making them easy to smuggle? >> the answer is yes, and i appreciate the very learned comment by that writer. >> so it makes it easier? you can also drink these? >> so most people smoke it, but there are reports of other means of ingesting it. what we're seeing in the streets of the district of columbia and throughout the country is mostly the powder being mixed in with solvents, sprayed on to those dry leafy substances and smoked. >> another tweet. the worst drugs are always

cheaper than the good ones and easier to get in low-income areas. >> i completely agree with that. that's right. there is a supply and demand and >> what has the district done in the last six months with convenience stores, et cetera, that are making these drugs available? >> as i indicated, the mayor and council have given the police chief authority to shut down any store that's found to have sold some of these substances up to 96 hours and very, very progressive and hefty fines. secondly, the district of columbia through my office has shut down stores for up to one year. that's no business at all in a store that was formerly making revenue. and we're still doing that. we have many cases that we are investigating and actively

enforcing. >> dan is in mansfield, ohio. please go ahead with your question or comment from karl racine, d.c. attorney general. >> caller: good morning. i lost a friend to that stuff, or i believe that contributed to it. he had smoked -- they called it posh around here. posh or i heard them talk about scooby snacks. it was like fake marijuana. i figured it was some kind of plant with chemicals sprayed on it. if people sniff gasoline that will do something to you, too. i bet it will eat up your brain. he started smoking that. i noticed that. one time he like had a mild sei seizeure or something and i said

you need to stop smoking that. it would be better to buy marijuana. i'm not pushing marijuana but it's the lesser of two evils. that stuff really is evil. and everything you said, mr. racine, boy, you all stole my thunder this morning. i wanted to call in and he really knows the facts. i'll turn it over to you for your comments, sir. >> i appreciate your calling in. it's my experience when people like you, sir, honestly call in and recount personal experiences that you've had or seen, your friends and associates have had with this substance, the message gets out even more vividly. this stuff can kill you. not only can it kill you but cause you to do things that can hurt other people. we need to get that message out. i'm happy to say that throughout the summer, notwithstanding the

increase in this drug. the mayor's office, council and office of attorney general have been reaching out to young people and the homeless community. >> can these drugs be made in someone's kitchen, much like methamphetamine? >> the answer is yes. >> we recently covered a panel talking about prosecuting crimes involved with synthetic drugs. >> these things called incense and bath salts are clearly intended for human consumption and the prosecutors who say there's nothing we can do, haven't been sufficiently creative in getting the targets of the investigation. why does a gas station sell something by the cash register called incense or bath salts? it's inconceivable to me that

you can't send in well-trained informants to get the clerk to make some kind of statement. it understands the clerk understands this is for human consumption. >> mr. racine? >> well, i can just tell you what's going on in the district of columbia. it's been red alert zone in the district of columbia and the government is organized and focused in every way to do just what the gentleman is suggesting needs to be done. aggressively go after those businesses who make money selling these chemical drugs that cause violent reactions in people. >> is the epicenter of this synthetic drug issue here in washington, or are the other major cities where it is, are they having it worse than we are here? >> i'm not sure if it's worse or better. what i can tell you, it's a

growing national epidemic. not only a d.c. problem. certainly the attorney general and the state of new york has been quite active. the police chief in new york has been quite active in this area. it's also getting into suburban america. so what we have as one of the callers indicated is a cheap way to get high. the high is not like the high some people believe it is. the high can cause significant damage to anyone who consumes it. >> the district has put up a website with the word zombie in it? what is the goal with this website? k2 zombie dc.com. >> it was quite responsible on the part of government to do just that. and the reason is we're looking to educatepe